• -Dear Sridhar,

    Has anyone noticed that our membership is inching towards Lara's 400?!

    Fondly, SB
  • Dear SB and all
    Iniya puthandu Vazhthukkal

    Thats very encouraging unfortunately I didnt notice it as I was travelling in the states.

    It llbe great if we reach the milestone
  • SPS,
    My suggestion is why don't we celeb Aadi 18 as our PS day? Each Aadi 18, esp the mun maalai neeram of Aadi 18.
    Still 17 days to go...
  • "ennadhu expenses divided" aa?

    vilayaadareenghalaa??? naan OC soru poduveenga... jollyaa saaptuttu
    varalaamnnu ninaichikinu irundhen....
  • //August 3rd Aadi 18th. //
    No probs in meeting on Aug 3rd. But preferrebly evening.
  • Hi all.

    Aadi 1 and Aadi 18 Greetings to all.

    Aadi 1 is celebrated in Kongu region as " Praying Lord
    Ganesh by coconut filled with rice, dhal, sweets"
  • Dhiwakar,

    Back to form.aa...good..Nagaraja chozhan also was killed
    Dhiwa...pakkara padatha ozhunga pakkanum.

    pavam sps...unakku oc soru potta avaru soththu kali...I would suggest,
    expense diveded by all except SPS. oru tharavayavathu nama selavu
    panni avaru sapidatume...

    Re. Aryan invasion theory...ennadhu...waiting for other members
    replya...appo nee member illiya...

    Venkat, even though outsiders came into India, they influencing local
    culture and religion...koncham too mucha ella...those points needs to
    be studied. Chinese travellers during 4-3 century BC have extensively
    written about indian festivals, culture etc. Is it possible for a
    culture to flourish so much in just 1000 years? 1000 varushatuku
    munnala kattina periya koila eppadi katinangane kandupidikka vakku
    illa namakku...then how can a new culture/relegion be formed within 10
    centureis...that too no revision or updates to scriptures at any point
    of time. (i have heard that the new testament is revised time and
    again to reflect the current social picture, so as to project and give
    a feeling that the scripture has everything)

    again i think I am getting into forbidden area...Dhiwakar, nee
    sonnadhu romba correct.
  • Just to inform you all guys... am not counting ppl. who already mail in the
    list of active members (how stupid ;). Am only recording those who have sent
    the adi 18 vaazhthukkal.

    So, even though you might be a regular, pl. send a mail wishing us a
    prosperous adi 18. (Call me a hypocrite, but this is how your name gets
    added to the active members list :)
  • Dear all...

    Long time no see from me too - but I'm here, and I'm signing in. :)
  • hi guys this is frm gautham.after british study systems came 2 implement that they only tell the story like aryans come frm a central asia.there is no civilisation in india before.according 2 athi shankarar he himself identied will they varied was down path vindhiya mountain people who all were living is dravida and upper part was romba kulambathinga.ellorukkum adi18 vaazhthukkal
  • Interesting article on aryan invasion...hehehe.. its greek invasion..
  • I stand with diwa, i too don't belive in sharing and all, enna eduthuu sinnapulla thanaa iruukuu.
  • Nanbarkal anaivarukkum Adi 18 vazhthukal (I think "vazhthukkal" would mean vazhthahiya kal, so let it be vazhthukal...ok. ok... ennoda ilakkona aaraichiya niruthikkaraen). Adhiyum anthamumillatha kala vellathil neenthi, let's join our "vanar kulathu veeran" at Veeranarayanapuram and.


    Quoting [email protected]:

    > Just to inform you all guys... am not counting ppl. who already mail in the
    list of active members (how stupid ;). Am only recording those who have sent
    the adi 18 vaazhthukkal.

    So, even though you might be a regular, pl. send a mail wishing us a
    prosperous adi 18. (Call me a hypocrite, but this is how your name gets
    added to the active members list :)
  • satish....

    nee andha padathoda second part paakalai nnu ninaikkaren.... anyway,
    if nagarajan was a chozhan obviously his son is also a chozhan..
    eppdi madakkinen paathiyaa....

    though we might not know clearly the name of the son, we cannot call
    chozha dynasty as extinct....

    enakku soru pottaa mattum dhaan avarukku dhanda selavu nnu yaaru
    sonnaa???!!! evvalavo irukku.. adhai naan unakkum sps sirkkum mattum
    mail anuppi theriyapadutharen.!!! unakku slightaa purinjirukkume

    naan ellaam member illappa....ennai group-prashtam panni pala days
    aaidchchu... idhey maadhiri experience thanakkum irukku nnu vera oru
    member kooda varuthapattu ezhudhikiraaru!!! vilanguchchaaa???? aa

    aana oru vishayam correctaa sonnappa nee....

    eththini dhabaa poi aaraaichi pannaalum periya koil eppadi
    kattinaanga nnu kandu pudikka vakkillai dhaan namakku....naamalum
    aaraichi pannom, pannikinu irukkom , innum pannuvom...

    "oorukaai" maadhiri namma seiyyaradhum oru "vinaithogai" aaidchchu..

    pirachanai ennanna... people take a lot of things personally ...

    "ramana " padathula andha "singh police" solluvaan...andha maadhiri

    andha distinction namakku therlai... vivaadhathai personalaa
    eduthukkaraanga....this applies to one and all including me...

    naama ellaarum idhey topic ai niraiya dhadavai group la pesi ketta
    peru vaanghirukkom .... hope u remember...

    aryan dravidan theory, hindu muslim christians theory ellaam romba
    romba personalaa eduthukkaraanga....

    but anyway, hindus ai kurai solradhu mattum summaa ellaa edathulayum
    jarooraa nadakkudhu....

    once karunanidhi told that he does not worship pillaiyar becoz
    pillaiyar is not from tamizhnadu.. he is from "vatapi" (taken from
    sivakamiyin sabatham)...

    he calls pillaiyar as aryan god and other nonsense....

    but idhey aalu goes to iftar party , church ellaam .... adhu eppdi
    if pillaiyar does not belong to tamilnadu, does jesus and the prophet
    belong to TN?? weird....

    indha maadhiri aalungalaala dhaan aryan-dravidian theory still
    rules.... vivekanandar during his period (more than 100 yers back)
    denounced this theory.... enna oru dheerga dharisanam..

    he clearly said that there is no such thing as invasion theory... it
    is the handiwork of westeners..

    this theory and other interpretations of sanskrit literature is based
    purely upon "Max mueller's" translation... nobody knows how far it is
    accurate... might be mr. max had true and genuine intentions.. but
    how far therse are correct nobody knows...

    for example frawley says the word "samudram" doesnt mean "sea
    alone"... it indicates a large water body.. but it is still
    interpreted as sea...

    idhellam sonnaa namma makkal nammalai "thirumba pirachanai panna
    vandhuttaan" nnu solluvaanga... idhellaam namakku
  • nanbaa...

    unnudaya adharavirkku nanri... sarithirathil un peyar
    ponnezhuthukkalaal porikkappadum..
  • Hi

    Aadi 18 Vazhthukkal to all group Members

    Arvind Valliappan
  • Aadi perukku Vazhthukkal to everyone.

    Madan: Ullaen Iyya
  • Aadi Perukku Vazhthukkal to everyone.

    Endrum Anbudan

  • Aadi Perukku Vazhthukkal ellorukkum.
  • SPS sir. About personal greeting to senior members.

    Technically, it is possible. Though am not aware of what tool to use right
    away. Will do some googling and find out and let you know....

    Do you want me to go through the first 1000 mails and get the email ids
    myself? Am afraid the only thing I have now is the mail archive at
    yahoogroups... and getting the email ids would be an ardurous task. Can you
    think of any other way to compile these ids?
  • Dear Madan,

    check whether this is of any help. the moderator of the group will be having an option Management(Message Posts), where he can view the groups mail activity along with the poster's mail id.
  • alas! am not one.. I guess SPS sir is... SPS sir, could you pl. check out
    this option sivaram is mentioning and let me know... thank you.

    Thanks for the tipoff, Sivaram. :)
  • Hi Satish/Diwakar,

    Some of the points in your email, really go to prove that as a culture we have been hypocrites and we have generally led to the growth of hypocritical people..

    I was watching a vijay tv show on sunday "neeya - naana" about non-brahmins becomes priests in hindu temples.. but there was one thing that struck true to me was thatchristanity or catholicism grew because it allowed anyone to become a priest without a prejudice, thats where our culture fails, if it can allow anyone to become a priest, provided that he can prove that he has learnt the vedas and is willing to provide guarantees about following the rigours of being a priest. why can't our madams and adheenams take over that role from govt and help in promoting peace, culture and religion amongst everyone without worrying about caste.. as long as the person is willing to perform his duties..
  • Madan,
    at a time-la 950(?) pera loosu akka unnala than...unnala mattum than
    mudiyum...'adi 18 vazhtukkal'. appa vote potuten...

    Good to see so many members mailing..thanks to SPS for this
    initiative. As usual I admire his talent of consolidating things. I
    used to wonder why the members link is not enabled for this
    group..yaru yaru membernu theriyave its a good
    occasion to know many new faces.

    Return of the Dragon...sorry toungue of the slip...return of the
    dhiwa (rendukkum periya vidhyasam illa...neerla pathavangalukku
    puriyum)...Dhiwa great to see you in full form after such a long
    gap.potruvar potratum thootruvar thootratum..un kalai paniyai
    niruthathe..(namitha fan cluba thamba sollaren..)

    > if nagarajan was a chozhan obviously his son is also a chozhan..
    > eppdi madakkinen paathiyaa....

    itha itha itha than naan edhirparthen. naan mail adikkum bothu nee
    enna reply pannuvenu nenacheno athaye neeyum anupitta...but my point
    is, his son never accepted him as his father. so he is not a
    chola...eppadi nanum madakkinen pathiya...

    > naan ellaam member illappa....ennai group-prashtam panni pala days
    > aaidchchu... idhey maadhiri experience thanakkum irukku nnu vera
    > member kooda varuthapattu ezhudhikiraaru!!! vilanguchchaaa???? aa
    > jinguchaa!!!

    puriyuthu nee sollara ellam puriyithu...koodiya seekiram ennayum
    group prashtam pannuvanganu nenaikiren...

    > naama ellaarum idhey topic ai niraiya dhadavai group la pesi ketta
    > peru vaanghirukkom .... hope u remember...

    markka mudiyavillai...marakkamudiyavillai...(Captain magal thane
    intha pattu?)

    > he calls pillaiyar as aryan god and other nonsense....
    > but idhey aalu goes to iftar party , church ellaam .... adhu
    > if pillaiyar does not belong to tamilnadu, does jesus and the
    > belong to TN?? weird....

    Dhiwakars punch...

    > he clearly said that there is no such thing as invasion theory...
    > is the handiwork of westeners..

    I too have read that Vivekananda's view. Do you know, Ambedkar, whom
    these anti-hindu people hail much, himself has opposed the Aryan
    invasion theory. He strongly condemned it saying that its a false
    theory. how is it?
  • Hi Nanda,
    Good point. This has been discussed in length many a times. Hinduism
    or rather sanathan dharma never prohibited anyone form getting in
    any varnam. varnam was never based on birth...ex. Valmiki, Vyasa and
    many other rishis were not brahmins by birth but they were brahmins
    by their they elevated or in todays sense learned the
    trick of the trade to become brahmins. So anyone saying that there
    is disparity in Hinduism is nonsense. please check the archives for
    more heated debates on this (Priya vaishnava enga
    poyiteenga...thaniya thavikka vituteengale. stats exam mudinchi
    varennu ponneenga. varusham onnu achu..innum exam mudiyalaya ella
    neenga mudikaliya)

    I never knew catholics can become a preist in a protestant church
    and a protestant can become a priest in catholic church. nisamava?
    can an India, why indian, an asian become the pope at vatican?
    round katti adipangappa....though they follow the same bible they
    both cant get to gether. itha pathi en pesa matengareenga. But you
    call christianity flexible and gives freedom to all. kashta kalamda

    anyone who has qualification can become a temple priest. A welcome
    rule. Can the same govt. come out with a rule saying that anyone who
    is qualified can become the father/bishop of church? rendu naalla
    atchi kavundhudum.

    And the article posted by Mr.Bala on Ariyar...good one. references
    to sangam literature on the work ariyar. Thanks a lot sir. This
    again proves that the version being spread..or rather the hatered
    being spread on the so called aryans are false. What do the
    advocates of aryan invasion theory says - aryans came and conquered
    india, formed a new religion called Hinduism, created the varnasrama
    dharma and created disparity in the society. and these aryans are
    brahmins who suppressed others in the name of Manu dharma. aryans
    are brahmins and so anti-brahminical sentiments spread across the

    ellam sari...manu dharma pragaram...or varnasrama dharma states that
    only kshtriya can fight, brahmins do not fight. but all these theory
    says that the aryans fought with the dravidians. all sangam
    literature says tamil kings fought with aryans. appo aryans eppadi
    sir brahmins aga mudiyum? they should be kshatryas and surely not
    brahmins. engiyo idikala...

    and all these references are only for Aryans. aryansnu orutharu
    erundha dravidas nu reference irukkanum illa...As venkatesh always
    says, look at the contemporary history. Can anyone say that any
    Sanskrit literature or any north indian literature has reference to
    the word 'dravida' or any war between tamil kings and aryan kings? I
    am seriously asking this as I dont have a clue on this. There should
    be two sides of a coin..just with the word Aryan, we have
    consturcted a fort with no foundation. i strongly feel this topic
    neds much more research than jumping into conclusion, and until
    anything is concluded nothing is history. Irony is, in India, even a
    theory, whether proved or not, is history. References to Aryan in
    sangam literature can mean something different or simply north
    indians(as the article states in many places) which we fail or
    rather dont want to think about.

    How many do you think, will learn the agamas and will willingly come
    and take the profession of a priest in a the temple. What will be
    the impact on the society? I have seen many small village temple,
    where a non-brahmin were priest, flourish and grow to pull large
    crowd and when it florishes, people look for a brahmin priest to
    replace the non-brahmin priest. When non-brahmins lay the
    foundation, have a comittee to develop the temple and administer it
    etc. why they look for a brahmin priest for replacement? Did any
    brahmins go and dominate them? No sir..its basically in our culture.
    Though not known to the common man, people even today think that
    brahmins can do this job better than themselves.Why do non brahmins
    call brahmin priet to perform pooja and marriage? no brahmin goes
    and influences them.. thats culture and religion. Govt. rules cannot
    change it. govt can only give a wrong meaning to the customs only
    for divide and rule policy. vote bank sir ellam vote bank. 'Dalit
    can become santhome church father' cannot fetch vote- it will only
    split vote.

    As Dhiwakar said, hindu bashing, everyone will come..other
    topics .moooch...

    I think I discussed with you about 'Paramartha Guru' stories in one
    of our trips. Did you read the article "Westerners and Tamil' by
    Mr.Bala. Veeramamunivar than sir antha kathaya ezhuthinathu. Hidden
    agenda, deface Hindu saints so that people disrespect Hindu saints.
    Westerners, though contributed a lot to Tamil, had an hidden agenda
    of conversion (missionary activities mentioned at many places in the
    article). So if they can shake the foundation of faith, they can
    easily penetrate. They did succeed to a large extent, and the impact
    is seen even today.
  • Wow...We have come a long way. Even if half of our members are active we are doing a great job. For those of you who have no clue of who i'm--I'm one of those earliest members who joined when Ram started this group. Hats off to Ram. I went back in time to find out how all this started and found a interesting thing. The predecessor to this group was a discussion thread in forum hub. When Ram started this group many replies in that forum were skeptical about it success and Ram was sure about the groups success. Without any doubt his conviction proved right. Even with the new group we were trying to do a lot of stuff and going no where. With the help of our members like SPS, Dr.Sridhar, Gokul, Lavanya and lot others (due to lack of space i'm leaving out some names) we now have a direction. Even to this day, i use ounal experience i would say people like me don't post a lot but remain active. I don't post any replies not because of disinterest , because ...Enakku onnumae theriyadhu :-). Even our Krupa seems to slowed down these days. I really hope our group moves to the next level as PSPV and becomes a name to recon with when it comes to dealing with Tamil history and heritage. With distinguished members like SPS sir, i'm sure we will get there.

    Finally - AAdI 18 VAZHTHUKKAL (Appada... now i'm an active member)

    Note: In case if someone is wondering about my contribution to this group - Bunch of failed attachment mails to Sathya and spoiling Krupa's career with an OCR.
  • satish,

    ambedkar matter - Super...

    coming to chozhan matter..

    Whereas the son did not accept his father, it goes beyond doubt that
    the deceased person is his father... hence in spite of relinquishment
    of the progenital status by the progeny, it is clarified beyond doubt
    that the relinquisher still inherits the progenital status by the
    rule of law unless and otherwise spcified.

    Hence, the relinquisher is declared as the official progeny of the
    deceased Mr. Nagaraja Chozhan...

    namma group kooda "pothy, chennai silks, saravana stores maadhiri
    aaidchu.... aadi maasa thallupadi nadatharaanga...

    "idhu valarchiyaa ... illai veezhchiyaa???".....tan tan tan tan tan
    tantann tan tadan... "theriyalaiyeppaa,......"
  • satish,

    summmaa pinni pedal edukkariye saami....

    "padma vyoogathula" pugundhu kalakkina abhimanyu maadhiri
    kalakkindirukka... continue continue.. aana unnai abhimanyu maadhiri
    thavikka vida maatom.. naangalum ulle vandhu engalaal aana udhavi

    As you said lot of comunities have their own problem...

    Mr. nanda was quoting muslims have flexibility..

    Mr. nanda sir, please read latest "nesakumar pakkam " on

    he says how many atrocities are there in muslim community.. he talks
    of one group of muslims capturing the local mosque and the other
    sections tries to get rid of them even by violence.. and how
    the "periyavargal" of their community try to suppress the matter
    before it reaches press and how the police turn deaf ear to the

    pls read

    indha maadhiri situation ulagathile irukkumbodhu, eppadi other
    communities are flexible nnu neenga statement vidareenga????

    Hinduism madhiri flexible aana religion kidaiyave kidaiyaadhu...

    brahmins are a sect based on profession.... as satish said earlier,
    people become brahmins only by their deeds... the great saint
    viswamitra who gave the gayathri mantram to the world is
    a "kshatriya" sir.. purinjukkonga....

    also, no people compel brahmins to be the priest... we are talking
    here about "core competency" sir.... core competency anybody can
    develop and anybody can replace and be replaced...

    so , brahmin dominating here.. there and everywhere is all

    These politicians want vote... and to get the vote and keep people in
    the dark so that whatever thing they do go unnoticed, these people
    find a easy vehicle called brahmin bashin... for that matter hindu

    these people are very actively supported by other religions also.....

    when da vinci code was banned in TN, dinamalar carried an article
    about tamil books which contain similar stuff as that of the movie...
    all these books were written by christians only ... yet nobody wants
    to take notice of that and even mention that...

    that is because only hindu bashing sells and hindu bashing works...

    in vijay TV when there was a debate on all people becoming priests,
    the funny part was that the thi.ka (DK) people were there suporting
    all people can become priests...

    the basic question is , thi.ka people are anti god... then why do
    they voice for a matter relating to temple..

    all that they can do in this issue is that take a stand that "people
    should not go to temple at all".. there is a very good cause for them
    in the issue to propogate their thoughts.. instead they are indulging
    in this...

    this is a very ripe situation for them..

    thi.ka people pls note this.. this a very good idea for you... was supporting coimbatore blasts.. they are part of the
    ruling alliance now.. who is going to bell them..(nesa kumar pakkam)

    ennavo ponga.. niraya vishayam have been kept under a veil and a
    malicious propaganda has been perpetrated.....

    in the northeast there are separatist groups entirely backed by the
    church... idhukellaam enna solluveenga...
  • ada pavi Dhiwakara...nee marketing managernu thane nenachen...eppo
    vakkil ana?ennamo solla varanu puriyithu.ana ennanu than puriyala..
    naan englishla koncham weakuppa...

    Exact words told by Ambedkar - "There is not a particle of evidence
    suggesting the invasion of India by the Aryans from outside
    India...The Aryan Race theory is so absurd that it ought to have
    been dead long ago"

    sonnavare dead long ago...but theory....?idhula innoru koothu
    theriyuma...veer savarkar has accepted the Aryan invasion theory.
    Accidentally came across this link..didnt find time to read
    fully..but a glimpse was impressive. namma charu nivedithava itha
    padikka sollanum.[email protected]/msg03715.html

    Coming to adi thallupadi...appo enna list eduthu reply
    pannathavangala ellam group prashtam panniduvangannu
    sollariya...athan PS Adi Thallupdaiya? therinchirundha vote
    poturukka matene....
  • satish

    nee vera veera savarkar is also a man full of conflictiing opinions
    like our subrahmanya bharathi...

    subrahmanya bharathi shouts, fights and does all things to oppose
    british... but the same person sings a welcome note for the prince of
    wales... koothu dhaan po... adhu maadhiri dhaan...

    unakku theriyaadha satish.. as usual naan ellaathileyume araikurai...
    same for vakkil too....

    idhuvaraikkum other group members namma topic kku edhaavadhu reply
    pannaangalaa paathiyaa?? naama rendu perum dhaan maathi maathi
    pesindu irukom... hmm... koothu dhaan po....

    ambedkar comedy does not stop there...he talked about reservation for
    say max 20 yers.. .. the man died.. but the man's saying is used for

    vote kidaikkanumnnaa edha marappadhu edhai marakkadha irukkaradhu nnu
    namma aalungaluku aththuppadi...
  • satish,

    yaarai paathu enna kelvi ketta nee??? ennai ennannu ninaicha....

    selavu panni vettla PS mail aya padippen... great insult to me...

    anyway, there is a problem in the yahoo server i suppose... all posts
    gets delayed.... or who knows ennoda post mattum delayed aa
    irukkanumnnu yaradhu sadhi pannaalum panni irukkalaam...

    iam reproducing the article 14,15,16, & 17 our indian consitution
    regarding "Right to Equality".

    Right to Equality

    14. Equality before law.—The State shall not deny to any person
    equality before the law or the equal protection of the laws within the
    territory of India.

    15. Prohibition of discrimination on grounds of religion, race,
    caste, sex or place of birth.—(1) The State shall not discriminate
    against any citizen on grounds only of religion, race, caste, sex,
    place of birth or any of them.
    (2) No citizen shall, on grounds only of religion, race, caste, sex,
    place of birth or any of them, be subject to any disability,
    liability, restriction or condition with regard to—
    (a) access to shops, public restaurants, hotels and places of public
    entertainment; or
    (b) the use of wells, tanks, bathing ghats, roads and places of public
    resort maintained wholly or partly out of State funds or dedicated to
    the use of the general public.
    (3) Nothing in this article shall prevent the State from making any
    special provision for women and children.
    (4) Nothing in this article or in clause (2) of article 29 shall
    prevent the State from making any special provision for the
    advancement of any socially and educationally backward classes of
    citizens or for the Scheduled Castes and the Scheduled Tribes.

    16. Equality of opportunity in matters of public employment.—(1) There
    shall be equality of opportunity for all citizens in matters relating
    to employment or appointment to any office under the State.
    (2) No citizen shall, on grounds only of religion, race, caste, sex,
    descent, place of birth, residence or any of them, be ineligible for,
    or discriminated against in respect of, any employment or office
    under the State.
    (3) Nothing in this article shall prevent Parliament from making any
    law prescribing, in regard to a class or classes of employment or
    appointment to an office under the Government of, or any local or
    other authority within, a State or Union territory, any requirement as
    to residence within that State or Union territory prior to such
    employment or appointment.
    (4) Nothing in this article shall prevent the State from making any
    provision for the reservation of appointments or posts in favour of
    any backward class of citizens which, in the opinion of the State, is
    not adequately represented in the services under the State.
    (4A) Nothing in this article shall prevent the State from making any
    provision for reservation in matters of promotion, with consequential
    seniority, to any class or classes of posts in the services under the
    State in favour of the Scheduled Castes and the Scheduled Tribes
    which, in the opinion of the State, are not adequately represented in
    the services under the State.
    (4B) Nothing in this article shall prevent the State from considering
    any unfilled vacancies of a year which are reserved for being filled
    up in that year in accordance with any provision for reservation made
    under clause (4) or clause (4A) as a separate class of vacancies to be
    filled up in any succeeding year or years and such class of vacancies
    shall not be considered together with the vacancies of the year in
    which they are being filled up for determining the ceiling of fifty
    per cent. reservation on total number of vacancies of that year.
    (5) Nothing in this article shall affect the operation of any law
    which provides that the incumbent of an office in connection with the
    affairs of any religious or denominational institution or any member
    of the governing body thereof shall be a person professing a
    particular religion or belonging to a particular denomination.

    17. Abolition of Untouchability.—"Untouchability'' is abolished and
    its practice in any form is forbidden. The enforcement of any
    disability arising out of "Untouchability'' shall be an offence
    punishable in accordance with law.

    unakkaavadhu murmur dhaan ketkudhu.. nethikku night en veetukku "auto"
    "porul" ethikinu vandhudichchu....
  • That was an interesting link. I was hoping to read Veer Savarkar's views too..
  • Friends,

    Please bear with me, as I go about discussing things which are entirely not in relation to anything in historical sense...


    I think u guys misquoted me out of context... similar to what the politicians say whenever their original comments are not well-meaning. Also you guys can cut out the sir..

    First, I was referrign to only chrisitians/catholics.. and not even to protestants or other groups and specifically not to muslims at all. Muslims have endless no. of groups, praying methods, differentiations and each groups calls others as infidels.. and goes about exterminating other groups and religions...

    I was refering only to priests.. I did not take it to the level of Pope.. When you look at priests, in the catholic community, there are from the same community, irrespective of whether he is a nadar, or a non-nadar(I do know that nadar chrisitians are move caste oriented.. you can misquote me here)

    Lets see, if by means of sheer college methodology followed by Catholics, lets say our Hindu Madams(eg. Shankarar, Madurai, Dharamapuram) allows people of any caste to shed their inhibitions and become priests, thats when we can go around the town saying that we have managed to kill the Caste Demon.. Also this step could infact break the religious conversion from hinduism to other religions, and we could infact bring back Ambedkar's family back to Hinduism.. enna naan sollurathu..

    As far DK being in the meeting, their agenda was clear they are not worried about gods, but about human rights.. It was very much pathetic to note, that our temple priests are living lives as near beggars, with a monthly salary of 1200rs.. but again, these are also people who should also be uplifted..
  • nanda good to see your mai...

    satish, namma rendu groupla oru aalu extra kidaichitaaru...nandavodu

    endha oru puratchiyum needikkaadhu.. maatram has to be through
    change in mentality which would be slow....

    industrial revolution , communist revolution , french revolution,
    white & green revolution , naxal revolution everything has own
    repurcussions which we people feel bad....

    kannagi was a revolutionary... but after that were there no
    kovalans??? nothing like it....

    so revolutions wil bring change may be for a very short term..

    thi.ka people udaichufied pillaiyars.. but what happened?? pillaiyar
    koil were built in all theru ... mukukku mukku pillaiyar koil dhaan
    namma oorla.....

    also mr. nanda, just by making everybody as priests, we cannot kill
    the caste demons...

    do you think conversion is just based on touching god's idol in

    conversion has a lot of economic implications too sir.. evvalavu
    dollar background la puraludhunnu ungalukku nallaave
    therinjirukkumnnnu ninaikkaren....

    conversion does not happen by volition.. rather it happens by

    it is being compulsorilly sold as if it is a product. people fail to
    understand that every religion is a way of life..

    also understand, priesthood is based upon grants given by kings to
    certain families to perform poojai for generations..

    and it is the right of each family to perform poojai in temples of

    how do you think , we can alter their rights just by a signature..??
    arent we denying them the promise our great kings say like Rajaraja
    gave them???

    may be new temples which are being built can have non brahmin
    priests.. let us try that....

    reg DK voicing for human rights.. really funny..

    these people have really different agenda sir...

    they want to divert people from really serious issues... rather want
    the people's energy to be focussed on trivial issues like this and
    divert their attention from rather important ones....
  • Dhiwakar,
    I know that you wont mail from home and that too at that hour. I
    also noticed that the mails i send are delayed by 4-5 hours. do
    others face the same problem?


    I understand your point.Ok. you say there is not caste in other
    religion. appo eppadi sir chatholic nadar non-catholic nadar
    picturela varanga...caste illana nadar mattum engirundhu
    vandhanga. .and Nadar is basically a hindu caste and how cam
    christians have that caste when they claim that christianity do not
    have caste.marubadiyum idikkala.. I remember one joke fwd in
    emails....a person travelling in the last compartment of the train
    wrote a letter to the station master..."Its difficult to getin and
    out of the last compartment, when the train stops in the station as
    the last compartment is outside the platform. So henceforth there
    should be no last compartment in trains." adhe mathiri christinatyla
    caste kedayathu..adhanala nadar christians also can become priest.

    and saying that any catholic can become a priest is as good as
    saying any brahmin can become a priest. I dont find any difference.
    Hinduismla brahmins oru sect-na,christinaityla catholics oru sect.
    avvalavuthan. I really dont understand how you find equality in
    christian catholics and not in Hindus?

    And like Dhiwakar pointed out, conversion is not just by belief..its
    by money power. Every month, please note every month, any one state
    in India gets around 3500 crore rupees for missionary activities.

    I am totally for a society where equality is practiced. I will be
    the first person to support if you mean a REAL equal society. But
    discriminating Hindus and uplifting others...this is not equality.If
    the govt. had come with a rule stating that any person who is
    qualified for a particular religion's priesthood can become the
    priest of that particular religion, I am 100% for it. Targeting only
    Hindus...its a shame for everyone of us, because we were, we are and
    we will be backboneless creatures.

    Dhiwakar, the sections you have posted..gavanichiya...equality pathi
    nalla ezhuthitu..kadaisila our gundu podaranga. Whatever the govt.
    feels as equality is equality. so govt. has the utmost power to
    overrule anything, whihc our politicians do very well.
  • satish,

    nee solradhu correct.. whatever govt feels as equality is equality...
    enakku puriyalla adhu eppadinnu.....

    adhey maadhiri naama rendu peru + mr. nanda dhaan mai anupparom..
    mathavanga yaarum .......asusual we both will be the castaways
  • satish/diwakar/others(Lets get them also involved)... :)

    I never said that there is no caste-ism in other religions. Even though christianity preaches equality, christians as people practice sect-ism, caste-ism, group-ism, seperate-isms in their own ways.

    Every other set of people or group practices "isms" in an way in which people on top are able to control directly or indirectly or covertly also ...

    I think I will have to quote myself again "In the Church or in the college, anyone wanting to take up priesthood can join and grow to be a priest", but to be a Pope, there are other sets of critierias, try to read "Angels & Demons" by Dan Brown, it will give you a small hindsight into that.

    But in our Hindu religion, to be a priest and to be accepted inside a well known temple, your caste is the primary acceptance factor. Unless its a village temple priests, people from other castes are not allowed to be a priest, even if you are well versed in vedas, practicies and also practice it zealously..

    Think it over, also there could be other people who are probably feeling offended by our comments here..

    I am of the opinion that customs and rules are guidelines, but not to be used for filtering out people on the basis of birth.
  • I beg to differ!

    There are lot of differences, in priesthood on Hindu temples.

    There are temples that were conscruted by Tamil Kings, and these
    Kings granted the priesthood to People who continue until today. All
    these people were of Brahmin community, there may be exceptions,
    that I am unaware.

    Priest at Palani claimed to be from the lineage, to whom Siddhar
    Pulipaani adhikaram.

    There are temples, like you have mentioned, have preisthood governed
    by different community Melmaruvathur by Vanniyar/Naicker, Putlur
    Poongavanathammam by Vanniyar/Naicker, Melmalaiyanur by Sembadavar,
    etc. And in temples like Padavedu, the 'Mudhal Mariyadhai', is for
    Vannan/Dobhi caste.

    And we cannot imagine if a Brahmin claim to posses the later temple,
    and hence similarly other caste into Brahmin temples.

    Some establishments like this are better to be untouched, and they
    will function well. But, for Tamil Nadu it is a curse, that we are
    never united on lingual grounds and always look for caste.

    Rajendhra Cholan!
  • satish/diwa,

    we are having one person joining the discussion

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