Are we remembering the Past?
  • All,

    When we heard about Tsunami, our heart wept, because innocent people
    died in lakhs. Everyone rushed to help and the relief and
    rehabilitation is being carried out. Probabaly after a few months
    they will be back to normal.

    Do we, the people, media, politicians, NGO's, Human rights activities
    etc. etc. the same whereever people suffer? If you all
    say 'yes definitely' then you are totally wrong.

    Today is the 15th anniversary of the ethnic clensing of Kashmiri
    Pandits from the State of Kashmir. Till date those 3+ lakh people are
    not bothered about, cared about and noone is ready to give a solution
    to them. One entire generation itself lost its history,culture and
    tradition. Isnt this history? since we talk and care about history in
    our group, I thought this is the right forum to put this link.

    Please go through the link given below. A very good article indeed.

    But how many of us, Indians, will accept this. As the article says,
    no one....

    On this day, atleast, lets pray for the lost souls, pray for the
    mental peace of the destitudes and pray for a solution to their
    problems. Prayer is the only thing which we can do.

    Hope you all oblige.
  • satish,

    A timely mail.Unfortunately this issue has become so political that
    whoever talks of pundits is branded as a BJP supporter and worst as
    a fundamentalist.I fully agree with what SPS said about this
    issue.However I dont accept nehru family as kashmiri pundits,since
    jawaharlal nehru was a sworn atheist and he detested castes and
    religion.He would not have wanted people to remember him as a
    kashmir pundit.So let us not call him like that.

    Anyway pundits should take heart from jews who were chased away from
    their motherland for 2000 years and reclaimed it back by valour.The
    story of Israel should be a motivating factor for any race that has
    been chased away from their homeland.I am not getting into politics
    of palestine and Israel,but what jews lost at sword point they
    gained in gun point.

    Sindhis are another race which was chased away from pakistan but now
    are prospering in businesses all over India.Parsis are another
    race.They were chased away from persia,but now Indias richest family
    Tata is a parsi family.They succeeded in businesses and are highly
    respected in North India.

    Pundits should draw solace from these examples.They should take
    things positively and have parsis,sindhis and jews as their
    examples.Jews waited for 2000 years.Its been just 14 years in case
    of pundits.Miles to go still.
  • Dear SPS and Sampath,

    I am very much delighted to see responses from you both, becuase when
    someone whom we consider as learned and keep in high strature agrees
    with our point, naturally our heart jumps in joy.
    As you both pointed out, favouring Hindus is termed fundamental in
    our country and favouring Minorities is considered to be Secularism.
    I go one step ahead of this and feel, even being neutral is termed
    fundamentalism in India. If you be neutral and say what is right and
    what is wrong, then we are branded as fundamentalist. All expect that
    everyone should support the minorities whatever crime they do and
    that is secularism. God save our land.

    As SPS pointed out, my heart too weeps to see my majority communitiy
    being thrashed in India. A year or so back, I read an article in
    Rediff titled 'Who is Minority?" by Rajeev srinivasan. He eloborated
    on the problem India is facing. To summarise he says, any
    community,irrespective of the number, which is subjected to harsh
    treatment,suppression and is ripped of its fundamental rights and
    live in constant fear and threat is minority community and in India,
    Hindus are minorities, because they fit in those parameters.

    But I have always seen that, even learned people fear to express such
    points or dont like to talk about it. Talking about it itself
    considered a shame and insecular. Thats why I said, I really felt
    happy seeing your mails.

    My point is, when we talk about our glorious past and feel proud of
    it, we should remember that our ancestors, let it be RR,Rj, the
    pallavas or pandiyas, ashoka or chandragupta or the nayakars or
    kambar or bharathi ...the list goes on, whoever it be,lived up to our
    expectations and left us a glorious history.Hope everyone agrees with
    this. But what we are leaving for our future generation? Isnt todays
    happenings tomorrows history? Today we know only the history for say
    a 1000 or 2000 years. Beyond that we dont have a trace...what will be
    the history 2000 years later. Then they wont be knowing about our
    glorious past.They dont know about RR or RJ, they only know about
    Satish or SPS or al. They will have a shameful history
    where the basic human rights have been ripped of from the public.

    Though we cannot do anything immediately, we should atleast think
    about it, becuase thoughts leads to action and action leads to
    results. Only our thougths today can reap results atleast 2000 yeas
    later. 'Parthiban Kanavu' of great chola empire took nearly 350 years
    to realise. If he had not dreamt of a mightly chola empire, do you
    think RR and RJ could have realized it? If we cannot be a RR or RJ
    atleast lets try to be Parthiban.

    I am giving this long lecture becuase, SPS, you said, lets leave this
    and concentrate on our distant past. Sorry if i have crossed my

    Again I say, prayer is the best medicine for this which our great
    faith advices. I dont know why, in the recent times I remember
    Hiranyakashipu and Narasimha avatharam on and off, and compare that
    puranam with the current situation. I dont want to get into the
    details here, but again as Narasimha came down to save the mass
    pleased by Prahaladans prayers, I belive he will come if we pray
    whole heartedly to rescue us also.
  • hi satish,sampath,sps,

    Nice bunch of mails on this topic.Even Kalki has
    mentioned this in his fifth part of PS.Chembian maadevi advises
    arulmozhi and vandhiya thevan in detail on this aspect.She points
    out to them that as warriors they should protect people belonging
    to different faiths in their country but also points out that in
    those days in north India temples were demolished and its the duty
    of vanthiya devan and arulmozhi to prevent it.

    I think we should all follow the example of chola
    kings.They patronized all religions and even built buddhist
    viharas.Arulmozhi even mentions jesus christ as a passing
    remark.chola kings were highly devotional but never let that
    interfere with their justice.the ease with which alwarkadiyan argues
    his religion to sembian madevi and arummozhi all of whom are
    saivites show how tolerent cholas were.But i think rather it shows
    how tolerent our hindu dharma is.Even in ramayana rama listens
    patiently when jabali preaches atheism to him.

    In mahabharatha too uthava preaches atheism to
    krishna.He asks krishna "If you are god why didnt you change the
    mind of duriyodana and prevent this war?".Krishna then gives the
    uthava geetha as answer.

    Even in vedas many atheistic verses are given.If you
    need to insult krishna you need not go to DK meetings.You have to
    just read mahabharatha.Sisubala uses so many abuses on
    krishna,insulting his parents,calling him as a loafer and so many

    All this only points out to the wonderful tolerance
    and magnanimity of hinduism.But many of us misunderstand that this
    magnanimity means cowardice.There is a thin line dividing
    magnanimity and cowardice.Our ancestros were magnanimous but not
    cowards.Even krishna tolerated sisubala only till the maximum limit.

    secularism,tolerence and freedom of speech have been
    the virtues of hinduism.Those values still keep our dharma
    alive.After 1000 years of enslavement no country retained its
    culture.Ours did.Now we have the side effects of such slavery.Slowly
    we will progress.Already US economy is cooling off and only India
    and china are looked with awe by the rest of the world.Japan already
    is ruling the west.Glorious days for asia are returning.

    If we know where magnanimity ends and cowardice begins everything
    will be alright.Let us be magnanimous but not cowards.Let us be
    valiant but not be bullies.
  • The basic problem is people are not proud of our land and language because of lack of awareness. I guess, we start making that happen we can take a very good turn towards success.

    Good to learn, there is atleast a thought that Ponniyinselvan is to be made a film. I hope the same will follow will all the other novels. And hence public, watching 'Alexander the Great', will also know, that there were kings in the land where they were born and live, who were much more valiant and good.

    What about getting the management and technical stuffs in tamil? We can get those things in tamil and make ourselves much more organized. The examples for those are abundant in our land itself rather than anyother part of the world.

    Rajendhra Cholan!
  • wow! Thats great to know that we all think on the same lines. SPS,
    you are right in saying that we are a very decent group and interact
    like close friends. Lets our binding grow over years and lets achive
    whatever we dream of. While writing the first mail, I was sure that
    Priya will reply to this chain...welcome back Priya.

    Coming to the point regarding Hindus are not attending brahmotsavam
    or other festivals. I feel, thats the greatness of Hinduism. We are
    free to choose where to go, whom to worship etc. But other religions
    dont have a choice. Moreover If I am given subsidy for my pilgirmage
    by the government, like the Haj subsidy, I too will surely go to all
    the pilgrim centers.Why, I think all Hindus will go? But
    unfortunately, our secular governments give subsidy only for Haj
    yatra and not for amarnath yatra. Our tax money, our hard earned
    offerings to various temples, can be spend for such subsidies,but we
    cannot get any such thing for us. With such a social situation how
    can we ask all to attend such festivals.

    I think, it was Raja Ram Mohan Roy, who popularised Vinayaka
    chaturthi in Bombay in the 19th century. He thought people need to
    meet in large number which can be used to inspire patriotism and
    fight for freedom. In this aspect, what SPS says is correct. We
    should have some meeting point to show our strength. But given a
    chance will we do that? We dont have security like others. If a Hindu
    talks about Hinduism in Public he will be harrased by the Police
    becuse he is spreading communal fire. At the same time, if Hinn comes
    to Blore for preching and converting, he is given police security. I
    think coming 30th there is a manadu convened in chennai by Hindu
    Munnani to show the unity of Hindus. How many of us will be there on
    that day? If I go, the very evening Police will come to my house and
    book me in some case or the other(actually this is happening in
    Kanchi at present )
    after all we are socialist, secular , democratic country.

    Good, given all these what can be done is a big question? Why such a
    partiality in our country. Are teh politicians bothered about the
    religion? No they are bothered about only money. and to earn money
    they should be in power and for that they need vote. Even though
    Christians and muslims account for only nearly 17% of the entire
    population, that 17% vote is a sure shot where as out of the 83% vote
    only 25% is confirmed and that too out that 25% it will be scattered
    to different parties based on castes. So who decides the winner? The
    imam of the mosque and the father of the churches. Whomever they say,
    the entire community votes for them. I really appreciate christians
    and muslims for their unity which Hindus lack. We should learn from
    them. The result is, the politicians get what they want from the
    minorities, but again they are also cheated. They too wont get
    anything from the government. All the people suffer without basic
    amenities. If Hindus can create a vote bank and stand united, we can
    solve half the problem. Can this be done? Think for yourself.

    I feel even the minority community should feel that, they are safe in
    India, and Hindus are their friends and neighbours. They are misled
    by fake leaders and they should realise this. If people start
    realising i think all the community can live in peace. They also
    should understand that we are magnanimous and not cowards. 'sadhu
    mirandal kadum kollathu'. Hope such situation never happens in our
    dear land.

    Starting the History and cultural institue can be a first step we can
    do to impart the knowledge of our glory to the new generation. Only
    if we know our past, we can shape our future, and I am happy that our
    group is on the right track. Lets hope for the better.

  • HI Priya,
    Great thinking and a great opening to ur new innings !!!
    Hope ur exams are all over and u are ready set go for a new series of interesting discussion.

    Inspired by your views on Frederick Foresyth, I bought his novel, "The day of the Jackal".
    I was so astonished that, how could such a slow moving dull novel could generate praise from you.
  • Hi all,

    My Exams and vacations are over.Back to school after a trip in
    midwest.Anyway I am sorry if Mr.shankaran did not like the day of
    the jackal.But its a classic and masterpeice.Is it slow moving?
    Initially it is a bit slow but the moment jackal steps inside france
    it goes at jet speed.That novel is famous only for the plot,a man
    who cannot be assasinated versus a man who dares to do it.Forsyth
    isnt popular like archer, but to know the difference between forsyth
    and archer we have to read 'fist of god' by forsyth and 'honor among
    thieves' by archer.

    Both novels have the same location Iraq, but after reading forsyth
    if you read honor among theieves you will be disappointed.Archer
    writes like a hollywood movie fast and action like but forsyth likes
    to set up the plot beautifully and then the action begins.He likes
    to reasearch thoroughly and writes very few novels a year but once
    you read them you wont like any other novels.

    I love his 'deceiver','fist of god'.But 'icon' was more of archer
    type novel.Negotiator and double deal were boring to be honest.But i
    cherished every moment of day of jackal.And please dont buy them
    because I say they are good.Somehow I end up reading books which
    will not be liked by the rest.But I love those books madly.

    To digress,satish had a torrential downpour of his feelings.When
    people are as unsatisfied with the society it leads to revolution.As
    somebody pointed out in a previous mail, Jews can be a very good
    example.They are just 6% in number in USA but they rule USA.They
    control media and dominate hollywood.They sit in important
    ministries in USA and decide the foreign policy of the american
    government.Their influence is so much that when pakistan came up
    with a movie called 'Jinnah' which they thought was retaliation to
    Richard attenburrough's 'Gandhi'-jews prevented it from being
    screened anywhere in USA.

    All leading magazines in USA like forbes,time,fortune are controlled
    by jews.80% of the worlds diamond trade is under control of jews.I
    have many jewsih freinds here and I have noted that they are
    fiercely religious.They love hebrew like anything.There are very few
    jews who convert, which is suprising since in USA if you study in a
    college if you dont date you are considered as uncompetetive.And
    many jewsish men and women date christians and when it comes to
    marriage its the christians who convert to jews.

    One friend of mine married a christian girl and made her get get
    rinsed in river to be converted into a jew.It was freezing when she
    did that and the river water was at 50 degrees farenheat.But the
    moment she did that she qualified to become an immigrant to israel.

    Even the relationship with christians and jews is funny
    here.Technically they have to be the worst of enemies,and they
    are.But they are united only by their hatred towards
    palestenians .Christians want jews to rule jerusalem and jews want
    to build their third temple in jerusalem.That temple was demolished
    in second century by romans and kalpih umar built a mosque there in
    7th century.Jews want that land back.

    Anyway I believe I am digressing.The point I wanted to make was
    this.Jews are assertive.They are very few in numbers,but they rule
    USA and hence the world.The entire middle east is hostile towards
    the jews but can do nothing.France,Germany and europe are anti-
    semitic but they cant do anything against the Jews.Its only since
    jews are stronger by virtue of their knowledge,faith and business

    Dont we have a lesson to learn from them?If we teach our children
    our language and religion and make them fierecely loyal to our
    culture and tell them "If our country want to progress you have to
    progress.Only if you sit at the head of a big business empire our
    country will develop"--we can rule the world.

    For that to happen we need as many indians as possible to come to
    USA and abroad.we need people in power in big influential
    companies.we need to earn a lot and sit in influential posts both in
    India and in west.We need to dominate every ministry, every company
    and every influential media.Then nobody can ignore us.

    That day isnt far away.
  • sorry it was vijay,not shankaran as I wrote in my mail.Sorry
    vijay,if you dint like jackal.
  • Priya
    You have left out 'Odessa File'. That's another mater
    piece of Forsyth. It was also a successful film with
    John Voight (Angelina Jolie's father) on the lead.
    Have you read 'No comebacks', collection of short
    stories by Forsyth? that's also a good one.


Howdy, Stranger!

It looks like you're new here. If you want to get involved, click one of these buttons!

Top Posters