I was going through few articles about The Restoration of THIRUMURAIS by RajaRaja Chozha. Some scholars say it wasnt done by RajaRaja Chozha the first. They say it was done by Aditha Chozha the son of Vijayalaya Chozha.....
> I was going through few articles about The Restoration of THIRUMURAIS by RajaRaja Chozha. Some scholars say it wasnt done by RajaRaja Chozha the first.
some historians beleive in the opposite hypothesis theory
that is challenge the existing beliefs and cause a storm in the teacup. the one i went thro was challenging the co existence of karuvurar and RRC the historians concerned just said RRC and karuvurar were of different ages, no theory proof other than that karuvurars thiruvisaipa song existed for a temple built by rrc's grandson.( but then we discovered that the historians had mistaken a wrong temple with a similar sounding name)
trust me. there are no details for or against any of these theories.
rrc is reported to have discovered and compiled these during his days. devaram was already being sung in temples though not everybody knew the devaram of all the temples.
very few details were recorded on the most important aspects of tamil history. so we still depend on legends and hearsay. so any body can challenge depending on their moods that day
As was mentioned in one of the previous posts, there is a depiction of Rajaraja and his entire family and court listening to great discourse by a venerated person in the murals of Big temple. This may be a depiction of listening to Nambi Andar Nambi after classifying the available decades.
The very confusion regarding cataloging of the hymns by Nambi is sourced to the Tirumuraikandapuram by Korravankudi Umapatisivam. (text available in the Project Madurai site. He mentions the name of the king as Rasarasa mannan Abayakulasekharan (verse 1, Rasarasa mannan (verse 6)kulasekhara (verse 13)and rest of the places as mannan. Sine Rajaraja was not known by the titles Abhayakulasekaran or kulasekaran, scholars had given several interpretations identifying the king from Aditya I.
Umapatisivam mentions all the eleven TMs, except that of Periyapuram. Taking the words of Umapatisivam in totality, scholars interprets than even Nambi Andar Nambi is of later Chola period. Others argues that Nambi will not include his own works in the catalog therefore, he did it upto the seventh TM and the rest were added later. The works itself require a critical evaluation.
The work was written about 13th century two centuries later than RR, who exhibited unflinching devotion to the hymns of the three nayanmars. It is likely that the very effort of collecting and cataloging the hymns would have become a tradition by ten, Based on the traditional account, Sivam would have compiled his account. Like any other account, some imaginary inaccuracies would have crept in by that time.
Perhaps a conjectural question arises here. Why Rajaraja did not record this great act of collection and cataloging in his epigraphs?
Exactly, he did this in his murals. The murals would be the key to many unknown dimensions of his personality which he chose not to represent in the lithic records, which are essentiallaly governmental records. Unfortunately, many of the panels are not available to us for study.
If there were Thevara Oduvars in Nadivarman and Parantaka period, then the story of Chidambaram Deekshidars keeping thevaram suvadis cannot be true.
The meaning of Thirumurai Kanda Chozhan must be some thing.
The no of thevarams lost after sekkizhar period itself is huge. I am quaoting a few from my memory.
Sambandar - Anegadangavadam, Kachi Mel Thali, Venpakkam, Thirukkarikkarai, thiruchuzhi - Sundarar - thirumanikkuzhi. I am just quoting a few that comes to my mind.
Looks many thevarams were lost even after RRC period and the poor Deekshidars were blamed for it. In fact Thevaram glorifies more on them and i heard that they are using that ref only in the Supreme Cour Appeal.
If there were Thevara Oduvars in Nadivarman and Parantaka period, then the story of Chidambaram Deekshidars keeping thevaram suvadis cannot be true
Dear S.N.
Othuthal of Thirumurai Thiruppathigam followed immediately after Moovar departed. Mostly all the songs were learnt, in those times, through HEARING only.
The same thing for Nammazhwar song too. It is said that Nadhamuni heard 'Aaaravamudha' song in Kudanthai Temple, when when some one singing. After enquiry he left for Thirukkurugur for collecting full songs.
Oothuthal was normal, but finding the 'Olai chuvadis' is different. There were references from Umapathisivam on this account of Thirumurai kanda cholan.
Again in Nadhamunigal story, it is said that at Alwar Thirunagari, Nammalwar appeared before him and again gave the pasurams after he recited the pasuramsuggested by Madhurakavi alwar.
This story again leads to lot of questions.
If all the temples had a oduvar and thery were singing the songs, then collecting from them will not be an issue. Now even after collecting the suvadis and the padigams of many temples which Sekkizhar gives as temples visited by Moovar are missing.
Can the ref of Umapathi sivam be given.
This is to learn more on Thevaram only. Because in 20th century suddenly we discovered 2 thevarams 1. Kiliyannavoor from a suvadi in Pondy and2. as an epigraph in Thiruvidaivai temple.
This topic needs extensive re-research and re-analysis.
Interesting aspect is that Rajaraja did not stop just with Nambiyandar nambi. He convened a lady from the family of Neelakanda yazhppanar - who had the knowledge of traditional raagas related to many padhigams - and asked her to set the songs to traditional tunes. Her name is Mathanga Soolamaniyar. I think this info is also from Kotravankudi Umapathi sivam.
There story has to be viewed in the context of Periyapuranam
1. Sambandar - Nallur Perumanam - Last song - Merged with Jyodi
2. Appar - Thiruppugalur - God came as a lion and swallowed him according to one story and merged with god according to periyapuranam.
3. Sundarar went by the White Elephant from Anjaikalam. Last song brought by Vayudevan.
Umapathi Sivachariyar song ( he him self performed a miracle at Chidambaram through his Kodikavi) says that all the songs ( specifically even the last song) were kept in the room with the Moovars seal. Very contradictory.
We have the first and last song of all the three and the ants ate only the middle? surprising.
Umapathi sivachariyar also tells that the deekshidars were keeping there becasue the Moovars sealed it. They were the custodians ( Like the custodians of the right to declare the heir to chola throne. Only when the do the Mudisootu, that is considered final.There can be another debate here)
Thirdly, when i visited the thevara thalam, they say all the three sang but only sambandar is avlbl or sundarar avlbl etc. In Uthamarkoil siva temple, gurukkal told that appar sang the temple but song lost.
Even in the famous sundarar getting gold from kamalalayam ( athula pottu kulathula thediya) he sang 2 songs. First asking for the one dropped at Virudhachalam.. God gave 14 carrot. Then once again a song for getting the original one. The second song is last even though mentioned in periyapuranam.
Many of the temples referred in Periyapuranam as having visited by moovar, the songs are missing now.
The Story needs to be analysed in different context.
Tried to collect the thalams visited by thevara Moovars from Periyapuranam. Compared that with the available padigams. Could not get much on Sundarar from the book i have on periyapuranam. ( Request help from members who can fill sundarar part)
1.There are many thalams visited by more than one but padigam of only one is available.
Like Thirumanikkuzhi - sung by all 3 but only sambandar available or Vennainallur - sung by all 3 but only sundarar available.
2. Thalams like Thirukkarikkarai - No thevaram available
This list is compiled from Periyapuranam. It is also not clear whether these were availabl at Sekkizhar time and lost ( as he did not mention the first word of these padigams) or they were lost before him. It is likely that they were lost after his time and Umapathisivam ( which is the sultanate period) and is covered by the story?
No mention of locking in Chidambaram by Sekkizhar. The list of padigams lost is as under. (Pl help to compile sundarar) around 42 apdigams assuming that they sung only one padigam in these places. It can be more also
I am not sure if this is in the same wave length as what your are attempting to do. My apologies if it is not.
I have an old 3-volume collection (pages literally falling apart, given to me by my teacher who is now 93 years old) of Thirunaavukkarasar's thEvaarams in which almost every pathikam mentions the (s)thalam that the pathikam relates to, along with the paNN (raagam?) and the name of the male (swami) and female (devi) deity of the thalam. I am listing the thalams below from this book.
Umapathi Sivachariyar story- Kanchi Mahaswami also explains the same story in his style: They wre worried about the loss of suvadis. Were worried on what to do?Heard a divine voice. The coming generations will not have much time. They will have time only for Cricket, Cinema ,Politics and Magazines and for all other things will have very little time. If they hear about one lakh padigams, nobody will touch. That is why we kept selected suvadis.
The lis given by you is the list of temples where the padigams of Apapr are available. The list given by me are the places mentioned as visited by Appar in Periyapuranam for which padigams are not available.
Like Thiruvennainallur, Thirukkarikkarai, Edirkolpadi etc ( of course the sundarar thevaram for 1 & 3 are available)