There is a place for serious tamil scholarship. All i'm saying that as long as tamil remains elitist, it will become a niche language, inaccessible to the common man. Shakespeare and Homer survive side by side with sms-lingo. Why is tamil so sensitive? What makes it so special that it shouldn't be flexible? Everybody can't understand the subtelities of literature.
And tamil teachers. They are so special, aren't they? They are so high up. They reach heights of the sky and stay there. Questioning your teacher is against culture, right? You gotta accept whatever he denounces from the pulpit. No different value systems, alternate point of view, fresh perspective and so on. Just know the poem by heart and quote it at wish and will to slam everybody into submission. Ever read Orwell's 1984?
So Kannagi burnt Madurai because her husband was killed by a human, error-prone king? Burning a city is called genocide. And no woman's honour can justify destroying a city. All right we get the message, Tamil people are chaste, but stop glorifying the city burning part. And isn't the book a bit biased towards men? Women are guardians of honour etc., What about men? Can they be loose?
And i read plenty of tamil books where a lady kills herself because her honour is taken by force. How can i justify it? The lady was honourable, she lived by the rules of the society, and she ought to be preserved by the society. Some rogue, taking advantage of the society's lack of vigilance, does an evil thing. By what scale will you justify the victim's death?
The great tamil refrain: Maanam ponaal uyir vida vendum. But Ruyard Kipling says If you can meet with triumph and disaster and treat those two imposters just the same; If you can fall and be pushed down to the earth and yet comeback, you are a man. Is life so cheap or you soul so noble that it must perish when it makes a human mistake? Isn't fighting back against impossible odds the greatest thing to do? And accept defeat, retreat and comeback stronger a mark of a selfless leader? For if he fights to ''veera maranam' it means his clan will have to suffer slavery until a new leader arises. The story of Robert Bruce? The moral of the spider and the web? That is the example to follow, atleast in this age.
Times are changing and tamil must change too. it must retain good things, reject snobbery, import good things from other languages and so on. And interpret its literature in view of changing times. A static language is a dead language.
Tamil is being studied by foreign scholars. Will they be called traitors by their people? So if i happen to use english will i become a 'bad' tamizhan? I know my country, my history and i'm aware it has its own strengths and weaknesses. If i want to preserve my language, i'd accept it has faults and emphasise the good things.
Tamil must stop being so pedantic and sensitive. There is place for diversity in it. There is no such thing as God's language, nature's language blah blah. And for the last time, stop teaching us "Isai Tamizh" and its glories by rote and teach us the Isai in tamizh. Teach us how to critically appraise it. Don't push opinions down our throat. Give us our tools and let our individual temperament flourish. Let tamizh be a dyanamic language with a cocktail of colourful dialects which can exist along with the pristine ancient form nurtured by high scholarship.
I had Three major Tamil Teachers and I was pathetic in Tamil...esp spellings. Though I scored 93 and 90 % respectively in 10 and 12th board. One of my all time favorite teacher was Mr.Varadharajan. Though we had a pet name for him(thats has stayed for 20 years now). He was very nice person who made us enjoy Tamil classes. he knew every one read from konar guide , so he would tell where all we need to make correction in Konar guide. He never complicated things kept it really simple. He would tell things like a story and in language we will understand. We never had notes or even notebook for his class, he let us enjoy the class and no stress at all. Simply all students loved him and till love him... Another person was Mrs. Vishalakshi she was very dedicated and gave notes and every other care students needed. But always the run away popular Tamil teacher was Mr.Vradharajan.
Then I shifted from CBSE to Matric in DAV gopalapuram. We had Mrs.Shanta as out Tamil teacher. She is teacher par excellence , her record shows , at least 5 state rankers(highest total with Tamil language) would have been her students(including one of my classmates).
But till life ends none of students of Mr.Varadharajan would forget him...very very popular and fun loving person.
So u too from DAV Gopalapuram..Which batch? Am from 1998-2000 batch. I really like Shanta Mam even though many in my class used to hate her :) I used to call Kantha a.l.a Kantha of rathakanneer.. As you said, the ND subjects were mostly abt society being biased towards the rich..Sevvalai, Aamai samugamum oomai muyalgalum, and the ones referred by you. Nothing that will entice the reader.
>>So Kannagi burnt Madurai because her husband was killed by a human, error-prone king? Burning a city is called genocide. And no woman's honour can justify destroying a city. All right we get the message, Tamil people are chaste, but stop glorifying the city burning part. And isn't the book a bit biased towards men? Women are guardians of honour etc., What about men? Can they be loose?
Sir, With all my dues respects, I accept all the moral fallacies and a male chauvinistic society of the old era. But that shouldn't keep one person away from the beautiful poetry of Silapadikaram. Kannagi's myth was never interesting to me as a school kid. But last year when I read the whole Silapadikaram Translation by Alain Danileou , I was bowled over the beautiful verses. It impressed me even in the translation. I love the 'Masaru ponne valambari muthe...' poetry of Illango. Unfortunately for political reasons , Kannagi as heroine is glorified than the poetry of Illango. Same in case of any other major Tamil works ...and to a greater extent Tamil History.
The urge to portray Tamil Literature older than Sanskrit has caused havoc and falsity, which is also heavily politically motivated. some how in the last century Politics has interfered and influenced the perception of Tamil Language. People in power want us to believe Tamil is classical and old , without making us realize the beauty and the reason scholars call it a classical language. We are spun around with falsification and myths that after point of time students find the ideas too old fashioned and desert the literature.
People really don't need to know whether Thiruvalluvar was born before CE or after CE. The emphasis should be on what he wrote. But unfortunatley here in Tamil Nadu people in power want to stress Thiruvalluvar to be a man born before Christ than what he says. Kamban's poetry is sacrificed to paint Rama a black face.
People have to see Tamil as language and Tamil culture two different things associated with each other , rather than two things as a whole. When they read Silapadikaram they should learn to appreciate the language and criticize the male dominated society.
Unfortunately we Tamilians in common have a feeling that what ever old is really good. Unless and until Tamil as language is seen as separate entity, the love for Tamil wont develop among the younger generation.
In complete agreement with you sir. Beauty of the tamil language is undeniable and should be savoured. I'm just having problems with the ideas they propagate with this language. And very few teachers take care to differentiate between good ideas and bad ideas. Mine did, and i'm proud of it. Teaching is a noble profession and only the best people in a field should be allowed to handle it. That goes for all professions. Doctor, engineer, lawyer. There is no higher duty than the propagation of knowledge.
When i decided to study Public Administration, the first thing my tamil teacher recommended was thirukkural. The verses about tyranny, good rule, spies were so concise, yet you could extract an essay if you spent some time thinking about a single verse. Original ideas, as good or better than Machiavelli's prince and Plato's republic. And yet at school, most of the time, teachers try to get us cram the verses. The priority should be to expound the ideas. Memorizing them is important, bur secondary.
As somebody said, change should start from the family. In fact the so called present decadent generation is very much interested in the language. I left college two years back and i had a few friends from english medium who could quote thirrukural out of the blue. It stuns the others and makes for effective punch line:-) Our only complaint is the quality of text books and the dominating theme in contemporary literature.
> > So Kannagi burnt Madurai because her husband was killed by a human, error-prone king? Burning a city is called genocide. And no woman's honour can justify destroying a city. All right we get the message, Tamil people are chaste, but stop glorifying the city burning part.
forget the literature part. it may be a over glorification hasnt it happened really the germans suffered untold miseries just because they tolerated the nazis and hitler. the japenese suffered great anhiliation as a consequence of the their reckless leaders. so somehow people are responsible for the actions of leaders they elect/ tolerate.
havent we all suffered because of the bad leaders we may have voted for.
venketesh
> > > > And i read plenty of tamil books where a lady kills herself because her honour is taken by force. How can i justify it? The lady was honourable, she lived by the rules of the society, and she ought to be preserved by the society. Some rogue, taking advantage of the society's lack of vigilance, does an evil thing. By what scale will you justify the victim's death? > > > > The great tamil refrain: Maanam ponaal uyir vida vendum. But Ruyard Kipling says If you can meet with triumph and disaster and treat those two imposters just the same; If you can fall and be pushed down to the earth and yet comeback, you are a man. Is life so cheap or you soul so noble that it must perish when it makes a human mistake? Isn't fighting back against impossible odds the greatest thing to do? And accept defeat, retreat and comeback stronger a mark of a selfless leader? For if he fights to ''veera maranam' it means his clan will have to suffer slavery until a new leader arises. The story of Robert Bruce? The moral of the spider and the web? That is the example to follow, atleast in this age. > > > > Times are changing and tamil must change too. it must retain good things, reject snobbery, import good things from other languages and so on. And interpret its literature in view of changing times. A static language is a dead language. > > > > Tamil is being studied by foreign scholars. Will they be called traitors by their people? So if i happen to use english will i become a 'bad' tamizhan? I know my country, my history and i'm aware it has its own strengths and weaknesses. If i want to preserve my language, i'd accept it has faults and emphasise the good things. > > > > Tamil must stop being so pedantic and sensitive. There is place for diversity in it. There is no such thing as God's language, nature's language blah blah. And for the last time, stop teaching us "Isai Tamizh" and its glories by rote and teach us the Isai in tamizh. Teach us how to critically appraise it. Don't push opinions down our throat. Give us our tools and let our individual temperament flourish. Let tamizh be a dyanamic language with a cocktail of colourful dialects which can exist along with the pristine ancient form nurtured by high scholarship. > > > >
Yes in monarchial societies the actions of the ruler determined the fate of the nation, that is why Helon of Troy, Sita of Ramayana and Draupadi of Mahabharat are deemed to have 'caused' the war - because their dishonor was equivalent to the dishonor of the whole country.
Monarchies functioned very differently than present day democracies do - and we must be careful extending the same logic especially as far as war and mass genocide goes. We should be however interested in fighting the extension of an outdated society's moral values to today's world and as Vairam said elevating the characters of a great work of literature such as Silappadikaram over and above the author. Most of it is caused by politics and the war over the aryan/dravidian theory. Our textbooks and our language is so tied in with vested interests of petty policitians that it is very difficult to change the perspective any other way.
Helen of Troy cannot be equated to Sita or Draupadi, that am sure would offend a lot of people.
Agamemnon & menelaus did not go to war coz of Helen's virtue (there are 100's of reasons - mythical and non - but none to reclaim her virtue) nor was Helen bound by any vows she committed before eloping with paris.
Ravi; I dont think Malathi compared Helen and Sita/Draupadi. She just pointed out that countries/cities wre destroyed because of the actions of individuals. The whole city/country was made to pay for actions of one of thier citizens. Im sure its the same with Sita,Draupadi or Helen.
- because their dishonor was equivalent to the dishonor of the whole country.
I guess, this statement, in the later context, led me to believe the dishonor of the women in scene. If that stood for the monarchs, it makes sense, but how does draupadi fit in that case?
Either Draupadi or Helen look a bit odd person out in the set of values provided.
Of course Draupadi was the wife of a monarch (Yudhistir) - her mockery of Duryodana during the yagna was what led to Duryodhana's revenge and her dishonor in court - and subsequent bloodshed of the Mahabharat war. Draupadi's dishonor is the single biggest reason for the Mahabharat war..am not sure if am missing something here but that is often quoted as a great example of subjects related to women and war.
Actually she does not laugh at karna - she rejects him as a non kshatriya and one who did not know his origins. Her rejection is also of course instigated by Sri Krishna who knew Karna's purpose was elsewhere.
The spontaneous reaction of laughing at Duryodana as he slipped on mirror like surface of Maya Sabha is what sends the kaurava prince into a revenge/rage coupled with his jealousy of his cousins. Female reaction in public, be it laughter or tears always has a bigger repercussions than men and is not easily understood or dismissed as human to this day.
"Female reaction in public, be it laughter or tears always has a bigger repercussions than men and is not easily understood or dismissed as human to this day." - Well said Mam!
he he great one Venkat:)) Brother Rahul, I mean acceptance of women as human has a long way to ago, after all it took so many years to accept a black guy as president :)