nandhini again
  • Hmm..somebody has to take up the defense of Vanathy
    again..
    I think she probably is the most mis-understood
    heroine based on the comments passed so far.
    Vanathy can be characterized as a muse to Arulmozhi,
    he says so at the very end. To say that Arunmozhi
    married Vanathy for the sake of Kundavai is
    disingenous. Arunmozhi confesses this to VT that if
    there is someone who can disturb him, it is her. He
    can talk in equal terms with Poonkuzhali, match
    Nanthini's wits, but cannot bear to see her suffer.
    Remember the dropping the arathi incident and what
    Arunmozhi tells Kundavai.
    Love is such a complex feeling, only a person who
    experiences it can actually comprehend it. I sent a
    mail long back comparing Vanathy to Ophelia in Hamlet.
    Both are just consummed by their love and there is
    nothing else that matters to them. Ophelia actually
    gets drown in the brook and dies because of the
    altercation with Hamlet. Nothing matters because their
    love is the only thing that leaves them breathing.
    Call it insipid,sombu-thooki or what not. Except
    Manimegalai or may be Oomai rani, every other love in
    PS is based either on the conveniance of it or because
    its practical. Kundavai loves VT because it makes sure
    she does not leave chola nadu. Nandhini, we all know
    what she was after. Poonkuzhali loves the chola throne
    and marries the guy who inherits it. Nothing comes
    nearer to the love which Vanathy bears for Arunmozhi
    and I do not think any one else would have made
    Arunmozhi happier in the entire novel.

    Lastly, the most favorite chapter in the entire PS for
    me is the 'Yaanai Paaga! Yaanai Paaga!'. This is a
    chapter that is full of playful dialogues and the kind
    of flirting that is a treat to read. I suggest you
    read this chapter a little more closely.

    Muthu Prakash R

    PS - I named my daughter 'Vanathy' but she is growing
    up more like a Poonkuzhali!!!

    http://www.jeysriprakash.com
    http://sibipranav.blogspot.com

    "'I can't explain myself, I'm afraid, Sir,' said Alice, 'because I'm not myself you see.'"
    -Alice in Alice In Wonderland
  • >
    >
    >
    > T.Rajendar court scen la pesara maathiri irukku
    >
    > venketesh
    > >
    > > rgds
    > > vj
    > >
    >
    ok sir, change pannitten -

    she was not the wife of RRC - Arulmozhi takes the name of RRc only on
    his cornonation - since she wasnt alive then - we can say she was
    the wife of arulmozhi......a dandanaka a dandanaka...
  • Docile & Calm will definitely achieve , but Dumb & Submissive?
  • Ha Ha ! Rajava irundadala Ok samaaniyana irundha?
  • Except
    > Manimegalai or may be Oomai rani, every other love in
    > PS is based either on the conveniance of it or because
    > its practical. Kundavai loves VT because it makes sure
    > she does not leave chola nadu. Nandhini, we all know
    > what she was after. Poonkuzhali loves the chola throne
    > and marries the guy who inherits it.

    True . very true. at that point arul mozhi was as faraway from
    inheriting the throne as you and me.
    an uncle and an elder brother waiting before him.

    vanathy like manimekalai loved a person. not what the person owned or
    was.
    but then nandini loved aaditya before she got into the pandya freedom
    movement too.
    perhaps it was that wrecked love that made her so vicious.

    venketesh
  • > Lastly, the most favorite chapter in the entire PS for
    > me is the 'Yaanai Paaga! Yaanai Paaga!'. This is a
    > chapter that is full of playful dialogues and the kind
    > of flirting that is a treat to read. I suggest you
    > read this chapter a little more closely.
    >
    > Muthu Prakash R
    >

    sabash,sariyana potti - now the arena is hotting up.
  • I think we should bring in the other heroines of kalki inside this
    too.

    sivakami, mangayarkarasi, the other kunthavi,


    venketesh
  • then nandini loved aaditya before she got into the pandya freedom
    > movement too.
    > perhaps it was that wrecked love that made her so vicious.
    >
    > venketesh
    >
    Sps sir,

    oru vaaram oru vaaram nu aaru masama no answers. enakku inooru unmai
    therinchaganum....aditya karikalan was married at the time of his
    assasination - you were to give us some dope on this as well. sir,
    engal thagam thaniya koncham time othukkunga
  • Good to hear your daughter is growing up like Poonguzhali, that is more with the times.

    I have not commented or criticised Vanathi's love for Arulmozhi. Even I like the Yaanaipaga chapter, but after all she ia also a princess from a family of warriors. I can understand a commoner being docile, fearful etc. but a princess (nevertheless from a chitrarasu) & one so closely associated with Kundavai, how can she be so insipid? Even her refusing to be rescued by Poonguzhali was a foolish act. Poonguzhali was far from her equal for Vanathi to have a rivalry, which is normally among equals.
    As for the arathi incident, Arulmozhi would have reacted the same way had it been anyone other than Vanathi there.
    May be Kundavai madiri oru nathanar kitta adangi poradhukkagave appidi irudhalo?
  • Hi

    of the real charecters that kalki chose to portray, kunthavai,
    vanathi and mangayarkarasi of SS.

    of the three kunthavai and vanathi may have kalvettus in their name.
    BUT mangayarkarasi has a devaram itself mentioning her.

    venketesh
  • Vijay neenga yeppa PS Veerappa aaneenga?
  • > >
    > venkat before that - someone told me that sivakami is short for
    > shivakamasudnari -


    shall check up on the etymology. definitely a link with kama.
    but the deity at chidambaram is sivakamasundari
    poem 68 of abirami andadi preceding the famous one thanam tharum
    kalvi tharum...(starts with paarum punalum...)

    sivakamasundari seeradikE
    saarum thavamudaiyaar
    padaiyaatha thanam illayE.

    venketesh
  • Docile is such a subjective term. I dont think she is docile. Take
    the case of Kundavai trying to changing her mind abt inheriting the
    throne. Vanathy refuses to entertain and stick to her sabatham. Also
    in the end when she actually saves PS from the flood. Or the 14th
    chapter (another fav of mine) when our hero VT throws his veera vel
    into a dummy croc. Vananthy approaches the croc without fear and
    says she is afraid only of roaches. But then we all have our fears.

    Insipid. We all have our prejudices and calling her stupid because
    of not allowing Poonkuzhali might be one. In fact,, will you call
    RRC a stupid for refusing to ascend the throne because that would
    have given another 15 years of his golden rule to the Cholas?
    By the same yard stick, everyone in PS makes their choices and
    refuse something or other. That doesn't make them insipid either.

    This comparison reminds me of another great romance 'Ivan Hoe' and
    the actual rivalry between Rowena and Rebecca. Rebecca is the one
    with all the handicaps (a jew, poor etc) and is almost like
    Poonkuzhali. Whereas Rowena is a saxon princess and hopelessly
    romantic like Vanathy. Guess who marries Ivan Hoe.

    But that aside, Vanathy remains one of the most romantic female
    character created by Kalki. On the same terms, Poonkuzhali might be
    the strongest, Nandhini the complex one.

    Muthu Prakash R
  • Let's look at it from a different angle. almost all the ladies in ps had multiple suitors drooling over them.

    Nandhini ... Sedi kodi thavara almsot everyone
    Kundavai ... Vd, patibendra pallavan,kandamaaran
    Poonguzali..vd, senthen amudhan, even arulmozhi..

    Aanal vandhikku .... Don't bees go to the most fragrant flower... So the winner is ....
  • One of Poonguzhali's suitors left out- Pinakapani !

    Giving up the Throne is one thing, but for every living being life is the most precious,(the lion is ready to be saved by a mouse). This girl is risking even her life, for what cause? not even as a sacrifice but just 'cos of her dislike for Poonguzhali.

    She sticks to her sabatham yes, but again it is giving up her rightful place as Patta Magishi
    just to defy a boatgirl whose comments should not even matter to her if she had any maturity that a future queen to be should have. She should have been proud of the fact that she is sure to win Arulmozhi & seen through Poonguzhali's jealousy.

    Anyway I think we've had too much of Vanathi, shd. take up other threads.
    Shobha
  • SPS,

    I think you are mixing up two different events. July 24th weekend
    trip was one of the very few trips I made and Pavithra was not part
    of that. i think she joined us only at Sangeetha. And I dont
    remember we all visiting the shore temple at night, because it was
    almost 10 when we reached Mamallai and visited the Shore temple only
    in the morning. YOu might be referring to another trip of yours with
    them.

    And that was when Kamal coined the name for you 'weekend vishnu'. :)
    meaning during weekend, you can be found everywhere.
    Saturday evening you came all the way from chennai and joined us at
    Uthiramerur and again left back to chennai. and agian the next
    morning you came to Mamallai again vanished and we found you again
    at hotel Sangeetha in the afternoon. That was the third or fourth
    time I met you and was shocked to see your stamina and switness in
    travelling.

    Ofcourse, in the next few months, September 3rd, we also experienced
    your driving.. cant forget Venkat chanting 'kakka kakka kanagavel
    kakka' from the rear seat of your Qualis :) around 12.30AM from
    Madurantakam to Chennai...
  • September 3rd, we also
    experienced
    > your driving.. cant forget Venkat chanting 'kakka kakka kanagavel
    > kakka' from the rear seat of your Qualis :) around 12.30AM from
    > Madurantakam to Chennai...
    >

    Yes sathish
    a real unforgettable trip.
    diwaker baskaran given the front seat on account of his size.
    incidentally diwaker came to the bookfair this time.

    I think the best photos of that trip were with suganya. hope she
    still has them.

    venketesh
  • Venkatesh,

    You live,
    So Rains pour!
  • //PS - I named my daughter 'Vanathy' but she is
    growing
    up more like a Poonkuzhali! !!//

    Good father, a better daughter!
  • I never got an oppurtunity to watch shore temple in pournami light.
    innum kuduthu vaikkalai....

    You can write Thirumbi parkirom, SPS, because you have so much to
    look back. But for me 2005 was most eventful - gaining a lot of
    contacts in this group, most of them turning out to be good friends.

    2005 Sep trip was the height of everything .....
    Kudavayil sir's description about the adavallan at Tanjai and the
    oduvars devaram still lingers in my memories....

    Many of the useful, firefighting discussions happened in 2005.
    Dhivakar and Swetha were at their best. Not forgetting Dhivakar's
    teasers for Suganya.... :) ayyoo vaya kelarareengale.... appuram
    Suganya phonelaye vandhu enna adipale...vidu joot...
  • I never got an oppurtunity to watch shore temple in pournami light.
    innum kuduthu vaikkalai....

    You can write Thirumbi parkirom, SPS, because you have so much to
    look back. But for me 2005 was most eventful - gaining a lot of
    contacts in this group, most of them turning out to be good friends.

    2005 Sep trip was the height of everything .....
    Kudavayil sir's description about the adavallan at Tanjai and the
    oduvars devaram still lingers in my memories....

    Many of the useful, firefighting discussions happened in 2005.
    Dhivakar and Swetha were at their best. Not forgetting Dhivakar's
    teasers for Suganya.... :) ayyoo vaya kelarareengale.... appuram
    Suganya phonelaye vandhu enna adipale...vidu joot...
  • Hi all.

    I am reading the very interesting discussions going on for long in this thread and feel like penning my own two-paise views on them.

    First of all the characterisation of Vaanathi. I feel Kalki has introduced a soft character like her and Manimekalai to balance the stronger ones like Nandini, Kundavai and Poonguzhali. Vaanathi and Manimekalai are smitted by love to the two heroes of the novel, PS and VD, and their entire characterisation is based on this one strong aspect while the trio of Nandini, Kundavai and Poonguzhali have been described as strong-willed and having several other interests apart from their love interests.

    I don't know whether one would like to term Vaanathi and Manimekalai as "boring" ones in the novel where
    there are other characters with better strengths of mind. Some readers may consider them as less attractive for these precise attributes, I feel.

    But to the credit of Kalki it must be mentioned that even these weak-kneed characters are built up into lifelike sketches by the Tamil wordsmith non-pareil. They act consistent to their characters from the first page in which they have been introduced to the last unlike the other three who make flip-flops at times. That's the greatness of Kalki's masterful storytelling!
  • make flip-flops at times. That's the
    greatness of Kalki's masterful storytelling!
    >

    all these female charecters make flip flops except for manimekalai.

    vanathi the fainting frightened girl sets off on her own to search
    for amising pS
    cruel nandini who torments periya paluvettaraiyar all the time finds
    time to tend him in the cave when he is dying.
    pungkuzhali ranges from a maniac to a brave girl saving ps more times
    than anybody else.
    kunthavai- the tough possesive girl finally tells vanthiyathevan. go
    and see manimekalai.

    kalki finishes the book with a feeling that nobody can be totally bad.

    venketesh


    > Regards
    >
    > Ramaswamy
    >
    >
    > To: [email protected]: [email protected]: Fri, 25 Jan 2008 09:39:23 -
    0800Subject: Re: [ponniyinselvan] Re: nandhini again
    >
    >
    >
    >
    > //PS - I named my daughter 'Vanathy' but she isgrowingup more like
    a Poonkuzhali! !!//Good father, a better daughter!--- Muthu Prakash
  • Hi All,

    I think the haters of vanathy have totally
    misunderstood her. I request those to go thru the book
    again. Actually she is potrayed as being very
    practical unlike Poonguzhali who always dreams of so
    many things and accomplishes only one or two in the
    end and that too not in the way she dreamt of.

    In case of vanathy she has only two goals/ambitions or
    whatever you call, in her life. One is to beget a son
    who could avenge her father's defeat before she met
    arulmozhi. And after meeting arulmozhi, marrying him
    was the another one. Kalki has mentioned very clearly
    that at first she had only this thought of begetting a
    son who is very brave. She often dreams about her son
    coming to her after emerging as victorious in all the
    battles he fought and thus making her proud. At this
    stage, she is not really bothered about her husband to
    be. He can be any X or Y.

    Once she met arulmozhi she thinks that she could not
    accept anyone but arulmozhi as her husband. So her
    thought of begetting a brave son becomes complex cause
    now it has to be thru arulmozhi only. And now this
    second thought must be fullfilled , then only she can
    think about her first ambition. And there were many
    pblms in marrying arulmozhi. It was not just easy
    though she was a princess. Now her objective was to
    get arulmozhi first and then beget a son thru him. She
    is not sure of getting arulmozhi. So only after
    meeting arulmozhi she gets this fainting habit.
    Remember kundavai telling arulmozhi that vanathy was
    very much carefree and talkative when she first came
    to pazhaiyaarai from kodumbaalur.

    Actually she is mentally very strong and sternly
    follows her mind till the end. Also the sabatham which
    she does is not just for poonkuzhali or anyone. It is
    actually for arulmozhi. Because though arulmozhi knows
    that vanathy loves him, he has an iota of thought that
    may be she loves him in hope of becoming a queen. This
    thought came to arulmozhi's mind because of kundavai,
    Periya velar etc. She makes the sabatham so that
    arulmozhi can understand her true love for him. When
    kundavai asks her why has she made such a terrible
    vow, she replies "Rombo naatkalaaga en manathil
    theermanitha vishayathai dhaan ippodhu palar
    ariyumbadi koorinen akka". So one can see that she is
    not influenced by anyone and she can never be. Her
    sabatham is for clearing away the stumbling blocks in
    her pathway to accomplish what she wants. It is after
    this episode that arulmozhi just makes explicit his
    hidden love for her.

    She is very stubborn also.She pays a deaf ear to
    kundavai when she wants to go to nagai for arulmozhi.
    She asks for vd's help but when he is not willing she
    decides to go all alone. These incidents are examples
    of how undeterred her mind is. Actually she proves
    her true love for arulmozhi over poonguzhali or
    anyone. Manimekalai fails to do this to VD.

    Even when arulmozhi teases her so many times she just
    remains quiet. She never gets angry , she never
    argues, which means that she is sure of herself. She
    is undisturbed. She accomplishes her goals in a very
    quiet and calm manner.

    One more point to be noted is that after knowing her
    mind fully, arulmozhi immediately agrees to marry her.
    Kundavai doesn't come in the picture at all. Vanathy
    tells him that he should marry her before he goes to
    nagai for political reasons for which he says okay.
    And finally he does that also. That's why they didn't
    wait for VD and others to come for their wedding.

    So arulmozhi and vanathy marry, influenced by their
    own minds. Kundavai had nothing to do here.
    Arulmozhi's teasing of vanathy is because of his love
    for her. He never does this to any other person.

    We all know that when a person has no problems in his
    personal front, he can concentrate on his carrer fully
    and reach greater heights. This is one reason why
    arulmozhi chose vanathy to be his bride. He tells her
    that he has so many ambitions and he feels afraid that
    she may become hinderous in achieving his goals.
    Vanathy clears that saying that she will never be a
    stumbling block for him. And arulmozhi understands
    that vanathy knows what she wants and what arulmozhi
    wants. And so he decides to marry her.

    In case of poonkuzhali, her mind wavers. She is not
    sure of what she wants actually. She keeps changing
    her thoughts every now and then. Nandhini also does
    this but is totally unpredictable. Poonguzhali accepts
    amudhan only when she comes to know fully that she
    cannot get arulmozhi. I like poonguzhali's character
    also.

    There is a saying " nam kai 5 viralkalum onna
    irukaadhu". All characters by kalki are like this.
    Each one has a different mind set, behaviour etc. But
    all are potrayed as mere humans. This is the
    highlight.

    Priya.
  • Wow Priya
    Very Good Analysis. Congrats!
    Shobha
  • Priya,

    very well analysed.

    Some of us confuse History with Ponniyinselvan..

    you have looked at her as a PS CHARACTER and gone into the details.

    Excellent. Pls post whenever convenient.

    sps
  • Hi
    can somebody throw light on the " samudra kumari episode'
    when does it happen and why does arulmozhi not recognize punguzhali
    a few years after this episode?( if i met pungkuzhali once i would
    not forget her for life!!)

    venketesh
  • wow, very nice post...


    but am not sure if vanathy had these goals set before her
    association with kundavai. please correct me if i am wrong, is it
    not kudanthai jothidar who puts the thought into their minds...chap
    10 - where he talks of the tamarai regai in her feet and the ali lai
    regai or macham in her stomach that will beget a son - who will rule
    whatever he sees...


    I dont remember reading of vanathi wanting to beget a son to avenge
    her father. infact when she realises that arulmazhi is setting out
    to srilanka she swoons.. infact in the initial scene - when kundavai
    makes fun of her and compares her and arulmozhi - comparing them to
    the sun and the early morning dew - she laments that she was not
    able to restrain the sun and he has gone about on his path to lanka..
  • Ya
    me too. i always remember vanathy hating war and especially the
    lankan war.

    venketesh--- In [email protected], "Vijay Kumar
  • Hi Priya,

    That was fantastic analysis of Vanthi. After seeing so many bashes on
    her, your post was quiet a change to read.
  • -Yes indeed

    petty chieftains were into activities like this.
    but namma aal viduvaaraa?
    socialist kalki made a boat girl the empress.

    venketesh
  • No. I dont agree with you. I am also not so impressed
    by Vanathi's charecter. But degrading her gaurdian's
    motive is unacceptable. Her gaurdian wanted Vanathi to
    be with safe and loving hands of Kundavai.
  • //they are kalki's own words..but then you would
    interpret it as some
    jolly banter among jealous girls!!!!but why devote an
    entire episode
    for this..//

    Hi Vijay, Kalki penned those words of jealous girls.
    But you penned those words of ill-motives of her
    gaurdian. After all Vanathi required a shelter.

    Vanathi required a shelter.

    But Poongkuzali is a qeen.
    Ever a Queen.
    Sometimes her Qeendom is her mind alone, sometimes her
    little boat,
    sometimes the jungles of Kodiyakkarai,
    sometimes the beaches of Kodiyakkarai,
    many a times the vast sea,
    oflate for quite sometime our beloved Choladesam and
    for ever the minds of Kalki and his readers!
  • Hi natrajan
    it was not the first time kalki mentions girls left in bigger palaces
    in the hope of snaring a good match.
    remember the chola king's words to his daughter mangayarkarasi( who
    is a tholi to the pallava empress) " if you get a good boy dont wait
    for me , marry him"


    venketesh

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