What is real literature?
  • Yesterday Myself and my brother in law and me had a discussion on - What is
    real literature? He is a voracious reader. ardent fan of PS has read it
    minimum 7-8 times. His voracious reading has taken him into the blog world
    where he bumped upon such topics. In those forums they have certain thumb
    rules I guess

    1. Literature should not be SWARASYAM (Can I replace it with the word
    "Interesting" / "Entertainer")
    2. It should be YEDHARTHAM
    3. YEDHARTHAM is always (Most of the time) painful
    4. SWARASYAM & YEDHARTHAM dont go hand in hand

    We concluded our discussion when we started surfing the TV channels -
    Chandramukhi was being telecast in one of the channel. he says - Manichitra
    Thaazh is Yedartham and Chandramukhi is Swarasyam. Manichitra Thazh is
    classic / Chandramukhi is Entertainer. In their opinion who ever writes in
    "Vegu Jana Pathrikkai" is not an "ilakkiyavaadhi" and things that are
    published in such magazines are not literature. So in that lines Kalki is
    not an ilakkiyavadhi. Ponniyin Selvan is not a literature. Did we have
    discussions in this line before?


    ~Udanx
  • HI
    great topic

    right you are.
    first you cant define literature.

    literature especially fiction is broadly divided as you say. a man
    who wants to tell a story to the best of his ability. kalki is one.
    a man who expresses feelings and situations in great amount of detail
    and writing skill. there are so many contemprory writers.

    simply like your page three stories in hindu and the editorial.

    "life of pi" a booker winning book has some 200 pages with one man
    and 3 animals on the boat in mid sea. imagine the skill of the author
    who describes the scene without any real development in the story.

    rushdie's books too explain a broad design visible only when you
    complete the book.
    i think most of us who are kalki lovers will come under the category
    of readers who want a story.
    venketesh
  • hi

    Nice topic. i guess its more to do with individual's preferences, and
    they keep changing as well.

    on that subject, not sure how many have watched this yourtube video
    earlier. its nature at its very best - every minute is thrilling, and
    am sure all of us will see a moral in this

    http://in.youtube.com/watch?v=LU8DDYz68kM&feature=related
  • Thank you Vijay, yes it is nature at its very best and amazing
    footage.

    Regarding the literature part, as Venkat said Kalki is enjoyed by
    heard from my teachers - lack of contrivance/coicidences forms a big
    part of classifying any work as great literature. Kalki liberally
    used those and hence his work is sometimes disqualified. It is
    difficult to agree with everything technically labelled that way
    though - Akilan for example had very flat characters with no humor or
    romance and yet he won Sahitya Akademi Award.

    So it is a combination of taste plus some critical factors also.

    Malathi
  • Dear Udanx,

    In their hey days, Sowcar Janaki (was doing Homely Characters) and
    Rajashree (was doing glamour roles) were strongly expressing views
    on KADHAIYA (Story ? ) - SADHAIYA (Glamour ?).

    Rajashree criticised Janaki stating Janaki had to stick to homely
    roles since she could not exhibit Glamour - appreciable by most of
    the viewers!

    Actress Lakshmi expressed ::

    Whether it is Literature - or Drama / Movie - it should be
    appealing to the MAJORITY OF THE AUDIENCE ... ! MASS ...
    particularly the RURAL MASS ..

    This view was also supported in Director KB's Sindhu Bhaivari -
    while projecting on NAATTU PAADALGAL (Folk lores)....

    We hail Shakespere's Dramas .. or Milton's Paradise Lost etc., as
    classical literature..

    Just compare these with UNNAL MUDIYUM tamil movie... which promotes
    positive thoughts among the under-developed or needy youth.

    I will vote for Unnal Mudiym Thambi because I understand this.. it
    motivates me... It pertains to my brothers.. kids..

    That way PONNIYINSELVAN pertains to my Mother Land .. It is related
    to my past Glory....

    IALLKIYAM is derived from LAKSHYAM.... TARGET / GOAL !

    Restoring or walking towards that Glorious past is my GOAL..

    That is my lakshyam.. that is why we are here.

    That is my Ilakkiyam !~

    anbudan / sps
  • Very well described Vijay...
    thanks for sharing.

    and Malathi has rightly compared the acknowledged ones with those
    which are not.

    anbudan / sps
  • In Simple terms, cant we say, a literature is something, which makes
    sense irrespective of the time period? Or rather which lasts in the
    memories of people even 100 years or 1000 years after it is written.
    Our sanga padalgal, tirukural, avvayar padalgal, kamba ramayanam, or
    the recent times Bharathiyar, bharathidasan et al...we read and
    re-read irrespective of the time period they were written. In that
    context, I think PS can be classified as a literature.

    swarasyam - yathartham....may be true superficially, but what moral we
    learn from them, what is the goal....yathartham can just picturise the
    emotions of an individual, but what it tells the reader? SPS rightly
    pointed out about the goals, and the purpose of literature.

    Anything which talks about something in a micro level will never last
    long. It can be a good read for a few years, but am not sure whether
    it will affect the people after a few generations.

    Somethings are even referred as classics and I remember reading
    somewhere a definition of classic as 'something which everyone talks
    high about, but no one reads'. Probably yathartham falls in this
    category :)
  • >
    > In Simple terms, cant we say, a literature is something, which makes
    > sense irrespective of the time period? Or rather which lasts in the
    > memories of people even 100 years or 1000 years after it is
    written.

    if we talk about good and bad arent we going into the quality.
    sometime back we had a list of novels published in tamil. ran into
    1000's . but most are out of print and not available to the public.
    isnt it injustice to the writer, publisher and upto the proof reader
    for them to be left out.
    i think literature is anything at all that people write for other
    people to read( of course we should exclude letters and wills)
    however i remain sympathetic to the cause of loveletters which must
    be included in literature.
    i wonder if people even write love letters these days???
    venketesh


    > Our sanga padalgal, tirukural, avvayar padalgal, kamba ramayanam, or
    > the recent times Bharathiyar, bharathidasan et al...we read and
    > re-read irrespective of the time period they were written. In that
    > context, I think PS can be classified as a literature.
    >
    > swarasyam - yathartham....may be true superficially, but what moral
    we
    > learn from them, what is the goal....yathartham can just picturise
    the
    > emotions of an individual, but what it tells the reader? SPS rightly
    > pointed out about the goals, and the purpose of literature.
    >
    > Anything which talks about something in a micro level will never
    last
    > long. It can be a good read for a few years, but am not sure whether
    > it will affect the people after a few generations.
    >
    > Somethings are even referred as classics and I remember reading
    > somewhere a definition of classic as 'something which everyone
    talks
    > high about, but no one reads'. Probably yathartham falls in this
    > category :)
    >
    > Regards,
    > Satish
    >
  • Thanks for the link Vijay, amazing video and lot of lessons to learn from.
     
    "Ondru pattaal undu vazhvu" 
    "Stick to your parents like glue"
    "leadership skills"
     
    Who is the less fortunate? Crocodile or lions!!.
    Who is the most fortunate? person who video tapped it or the calf.
    What will happen to the life cycle if the preys start attacking and carnivores  go hungry. I was happy to see the calf escape, but also felt for the lion that he did not get to eat (
    "Kaikku etinaadhu vaikku ettavillai").
     
    Anandhi
  • Venkatesh,

    Am I getting it wrong? Is there any thing which we call literature is
    of bad quality? Only good quality work will surface over time. Junk
    will be discarded in the natural process. So if a literature survives,
    surely it will be of good quality. If whatever is written, except
    letters and wills are literature, what do you thing - will all the
    novels published in 'Pocket Novel','Crime Novel' etc will be treated
    equal with PS? both are literature as per your definition, right?
    Which will survive the test of time?

    Anything should have a goal, purpose and should address this
    irrespective of the time period. It can either be swarasyam (PS) or
    yathartham (alai oosai) but should be for a specific purpose. If i
    read something today and is not relevant, whats use of reading?

    I feel nature (or should I say time) always handle things in a
    balanced way. As we got only the cream of Thevaram and the rest were
    destroyed by nature, only the cream will survive and rest will
    perish. May be in a short time, it can termed injustice to the author,
    but after 1000 years??
  • So many view points...the only thing which struck me watching the
    video was.....even the unity exhibited by animals, we cant find it in
    Humans :(
  • THAT IS THE GREATEST PHILOSOPHICAL QUEST FROM THE VEDIC ORIGINS !

    REGARDS/ SPS

    =============
  • > Somethings are even referred as classics and I remember reading
    > somewhere a definition of classic as 'something which everyone talks
    > high about, but no one reads'.

    Probably yathartham falls in this
    category :)
  • Dear SPs, very well put..I would rather say Puranaanuru or Sanga
    Illakkiyam instead of Shakespeare or Paradise lost though just for a
    comparison.

    I believe it is positive and very important to develop a likeness and
    taste for both - the classical as well as the mundane. The problem we
    have most people think they can only appreciate one of the two, and
    mostly do not want to make any effort for appreciating something more
    difficult or challenging. It is easy to read PS than it is to read
    Sanga Illaiyam of course but we would lose glorious literature if
    nobody like our Vairam made the effort to read it, is it not?

    On the same lines am reading Arvind Adiga's White Tiger, the most
    recent Pulitzer winning novel, am only a few pages into it. The
    library here in US had a book discussion which I was a spectator of,
    for this novel. One gentleman there asked a question to me - why are
    you Indians so keen on selling your poverty/other weaknesses to the
    rest of the world, we in America have lots of problems too, nobody
    writes books and wins prizes for them. Interesting point, isn't it
    not? (Adiga's argument was that his book raises awareness, also not
    to be dismissed).

    Malathi
  • >
    > Am I getting it wrong? Is there any thing which we call literature
    is
    > of bad quality? Only good quality work will surface over time. Junk
    > will be discarded in the natural process. So if a literature
    survives,
    > surely it will be of good quality.


    literature can be suppressed as it is usually done for other reasons.
    just imagine the 1000s of book that must have been written and never
    published in soviet russia, or today's china or north korea.
    imagine the struggle solsenztien went thro to get his book see the
    light of the day.
    how many could have done it?
    does it term them bad
    DR ZHIVAGO
    nobel laureate boris Pasternak wrote his autobiographical hero
    Zhivago, derived from the Russian word for live in 1953-54
    As the book was frowned upon by the Soviet authorities, Doctor
    Zhivago was smuggled abroad by his friend Isaiah Berlin and published
    in an Italian translation by the Italian publishing house Feltrinelli
    in 1957. The novel became an instant sensation, and was subsequently
    translated and published in many non-Soviet bloc countries. In 1958
    and 1959, the American edition spent 26 weeks at the top of The New
    York Times' bestseller list. Although none of his Soviet critics had
    the chance to read the proscribed novel, some of them publicly
    demanded, "kick the pig out of our kitchen-garden," i.e., expel
    Pasternak from the USSR. This led to a jocular Russian saying used to
    poke fun at illiterate criticism, "I did not read Pasternak, but I
    condemn him".
    Doctor Zhivago was eventually published in the USSR in 1988.

    on the other hand back home Godse's speech during his court
    testifying was published after a court order 30 40 years after it was
    delivered. forget the author, the content reflects a viewpoint doesnt
    it?

    venketesh











    If whatever is written, except
    > letters and wills are literature, what do you thing - will all the
    > novels published in 'Pocket Novel','Crime Novel' etc will be treated
    > equal with PS? both are literature as per your definition, right?
    > Which will survive the test of time?
    >
    > Anything should have a goal, purpose and should address this
    > irrespective of the time period. It can either be swarasyam (PS) or
    > yathartham (alai oosai) but should be for a specific purpose. If i
    > read something today and is not relevant, whats use of reading?
    >
    > I feel nature (or should I say time) always handle things in a
    > balanced way. As we got only the cream of Thevaram and the rest were
    > destroyed by nature, only the cream will survive and rest will
    > perish. May be in a short time, it can termed injustice to the
    author,
    > but after 1000 years??
    >
    > Regards,
    > Satish
    >
  • I think any writing that gives enjoyment to the intellect (Budhi)
    rather than to the 'mind' would fall within 'Literature'. Some novels
    are not so easy to read because you have to 'think' while you are
    reading. Most popular novels are easy to read. As with many things,
    the distinction is relative. The more intellectual entertainment and
    enjoyment a piece of writing gives, the more chance that it will be
    categorized as 'literature'.

    Similar distinction can be made between cassical music and popular
    music, cassical dance and popular dance,subtle humour and vulgar
    humour,etc.

    Kind Regards,
    Atpu.
  • SPS well said.

    Literature is an expression of a deeply felt feeling. An expression of
    a beautiful mind. When we savor it - our mind embeds it into the
    dimension of another mind. That is why we all had so many
    interpretations of Dasavatharam movie.
    What more is literature that Nature cannot offer?
    Literature in my humble opinion, is not confined to education from
    others, what we observe from our mind is the greatest literature one
    can read.

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